Transcript 0:00 Talk to me. Information, news and entertainment on demand. WUSradio.com. 0:11 [on-hold music] Welcome to the Peggy Smedley Show, the voice of IoT in our connected world, with your host, Peggy Smedley. Hello, listeners, and welcome back to the Peggy Smedley Show. 0:26 My next guest today has more than twenty years of experience selling technology products and solutions. He joined his current company in two thousand and sixteen, and he works with a team to solve complex problems. 0:40 Please welcome Paul Lucier, and he is the vice president of sales and business development of Aisera. Paul, welcome to the show. Thank you, Peggy. It's a pleasure to be here. 0:53 So Paul, we're talking about all of this quantum computing, and there's a lot of interesting comments and, and thoughts about it. 1:00 And I guess from your perspective, it sounds like you've been involved in this whole quantum thought process. 1:07 So, you know, if you think about it and you think about quantum right now, and if you heard my last guest who's really talked about there's a lot of different players getting involved. 1:16 We've got Microsoft and, and their view on taking a very conservative approach on what is quantum to even some of the other giants like Google and IBM and, and all of their position and what D-Wave's doing. 1:29 And, and if you talk about where the algorithms are and, and what really is, it's, it's a lot of investment, but it's all in different ways of looking at what we're really talking about and really can you bring a product to market and really what truly are those products you're bringing to market and what do customers really need to know versus is it truly gonna be something you can work with? 1:55 And I guess from your perspective, you're out there selling it, talking it, believing in it and those benefits, you know, what's the potential gain? 2:05 What's the cautionary tale, I guess, you're out there telling customers about it? Well, there's, there's really two sides to quantum. 2:13 Um, there is the, the potential and the incredible positive disruption from, uh, the opportunities it will bring forward. 2:20 Uh, you know, things like the new design of mat-- new materials, uh, big data, being able to sort unstructured data very quickly, everything from weather services to chemistry to machine learning, driving machine learning and AI. 2:33 Uh, those are, those are some of the areas that, you know, you hear talked about quite a bit, uh, as far as positive disruption goes, and that's gonna generate massive opportunity and massive, uh, uh, economic gain for, for many companies around the world. 2:45 Um, we are focused more on the, I would call the dark side of quantum computing, and that is it's also capable of breaking the encryption. I think some of your previous guests have, have spoken about that. 2:55 So that's where our focus is. Uh, I mean, we, we think that, uh, there is a, a great deal of investment being made. 3:01 Um, as you mentioned, some of the companies we-- you mentioned, uh, Intel's another one, and many, uh, academic institutions around the world and, and governments are heavily invested in this as, as well. 3:10 I know the Chinese government invested twelve billion dollars. Alibaba's added to that. 3:15 I think it's up to about twenty-two to twenty-four billion dollars now in China, which is, you know, very telling that there's obviously a, a path forward, uh, that they see and it's, uh, significant, um, opportunities they see as well. 3:27 So the advantages are there, but also we have to be concerned about what it can do on the, on the flip side, and that is being able to break the public key cryptography and the threat that that poses. 3:39 So let's talk about that. 3:40 Let's take a step back before we talk about the, the quantum threat because you just said something very telling and, and that raises a question to the comment again about other nations because other nations seem to be investing faster or taking quantum, I don't wanna say more seriously, but are farther along in the quantum investment, so to speak, the economic investment than we are. 4:07 And that puts us somewhat at risk. And although we see the benefits, but yet that does put us behind again like we have been with connected devices and security. 4:18 Now we're gonna be behind in quantum unless we get into the horse race sooner. 4:22 So do we need to understand there's a, you know, we need to invest 'cause other countries are already investing billions of dollars like you just described? Well, I think, I think it's-- you have to be careful. 4:35 I mean, I do agree there is a more cohesive strategy in some of the countries. Certainly China has a very cohesive strategy. The UK and, and we're here in Canada as well. 4:44 Um, there's some fairly cohesive strategies being put in place. 4:48 The United States is a little bit different in the sense that there's, there is massive investment being made, but it's being made by the commercial players in the United States. 4:55 So you could argue they're well ahead in the development of quantum computing, but there isn't a national strategy and I think that's what is lacking and probably what needs to be addressed very soon. 5:05 Uh, I know I've spent a great deal of time in Washington on Capitol Hill meeting with members of Congress and members of the science and, and cybersecurity committees. 5:12 Uh, there's a great concern about the amount of investment being made by the Chinese, uh, and the government strategy that's in play there. 5:19 It's a very purposeful and strategic vision they have, uh, and they throw money at it very quickly and they can develop, uh, and use that money very quickly, whereas we are-- we do not have a national strategy per se. 5:30 So I think there is-- there are calls for that. Um, there's also been calls for something like a Manhattan style project, um, you know, where we bring allies and industry together to, to tackle this. 5:40 It's certainly a race we can't afford to lose. 5:43 Um, it is, you know, as I mentioned, the great economic impact that, uh, whoever wins this race of having a quantum computer first gains, but also the espionage abilities that they will gain as well. 5:55 And it's, it's very much a, a race that, uh, you know, there are many nations involved in. Um, but I do think there is a significant investment in the United States. 6:03 I just don't see it from a national, um, you know, I, I guess a national strategic level.So let's talk about the quantum threat just in general from, you know, needing maybe a current public key, maybe cryptography kind of perspective. 6:19 Because I think when I look at what we have to do, I think from a large-scale perspective, we have to be ahead of, you know, I guess, the bad guys, right? 6:29 I mean, if we're gonna think about security kind of things and we think about all of this, that's what we're kind of thinking about, right? I mean, what's your thoughts on that? Yeah. No, absolutely. 6:39 And I think it's important to note that, you know, people often think that quantum computers will replace a classical computer, and I think it's, it's probably very important for your listeners to understand that classical computing will live on, and there's always gonna be a need for classical computing. 6:51 But quantum computing for certain classes of problems will, will be, you know, millions of times faster, and it will solve problems we are not able to solve at all today. 6:59 So there's a, there's a very strategic, um, you know, use for quantum computers that will, uh, will work very well with classical together. 7:07 Um, I think what's important though is that, uh, people understand that, uh, when the public key cryptography that, that quantum computers can break, um, starts to happen, it's gonna take a long time for us to start to, uh, to get to the point where we have everything quantum safe or migrated to a security that is quantum resistant. 7:26 Um, so that time period is, is, is, uh, is quickly approaching. You know, there's a lot of debate right now about when quantum computers will arrive, uh, and we call that the Y2Q range, years to quantum range. 7:37 Um, it's similar to Y2K in the sense that there's a, a train on the tracks that's coming, and we have to, uh, prepare for it. Um, but different from Y2K because we don't know the exact date. 7:47 Uh, however, we know with certainty what will happen when quantum computers reach a certain size and, and are able to crack the encryption. So, uh, that, uh, that range estimate is from seven to fifteen years. 7:58 So we know that sometime in that range, we ex- we should expect to see a quantum computer large enough to be able to do the damage, uh, to our encryption. 8:06 Um, and so we really have a short window of opportunity to fix that, uh, that, uh, that problem. Are you proposing certain things need to be done? I mean, nobody has a, a real idea of what can be done. 8:20 Are, are you guys saying you have it or are you just saying, "Look, we've got to all rally the, the forces together," kind of thing? Well, there's a couple of approaches to solving this, this issue. 8:30 Um, and first and foremost, uh, is, uh, is post-quantum cryptography, and that's the area that we're involved in. There's also something called quantum key distribution. I'll give you a very brief description of both. 8:40 But quantum key distribution is the ability to send, uh, the keys that are gonna be required over a quantum entanglement of like, uh, from a point A to point B, uh, and it's very much in its infant stage. 8:52 The Chinese have made some major investment in that type of technology. 8:55 You may have heard about, uh, the fact that they've been able to do a, a twelve hundred kilometer, I think it's twelve hundred kilometers, uh, key exchange using a satellite. 9:03 Uh, and there's, there's other work around the world. Canada here is also doing some work on this as well. Um, so that's one approach, and that would be a physics approach. 9:11 Uh, the mathematical approach, which we feel is the faster approach and certainly the one, um, that will be able to be realized quicker, would be swapping out the quantum vulnerable algorithms that we use today in our encryption, uh, with quantum resistant algorithms that do exist. 9:27 Uh, and the- these are public algorithms that have existed, uh, they're industry recognized, but they've never been really applied on an IoT sensor or, you know, within the products that we use today. 9:36 So they have very pure mathematical, uh, uh, cl- they're very clean and pure mathematical algorithms. 9:43 But when we put them on an IoT sensor or somewhere else and it takes thirty minutes to encrypt it, that's not very useful. 9:49 So that's in fact what our company is focused on, Aisera, um, being able to optimize and make them very efficient so that they work fast, as fast or even faster than the encryption algorithms we use today. 10:00 Uh, so those are the two approaches. There are solutions for both. There are companies that are out there today that have solutions. Uh, we certainly have our, our toolkit that's available. 10:09 Um, there are quantum key distribution companies that are doing work there as well on a, on a limited basis from a, from a geography perspective. 10:16 Um, you know, effectively about a hundred-kilometer range I think is d- very doable today to send a key point A to point B. 10:22 Um, so there are solutions that do exist, and there's, there's nothing stopping from, you know, the, the, uh, OEMs and government or anyone who works directly with encryption from starting to implement solutions and certainly test and do proof of concept work. 10:36 So does some of this come down to then, as we say this, is whether you talk about mathematical or physics, are we ultimately coming down to our chips again? I mean, is it coming down? You just said algorithms. 10:49 Is some of that also gonna come through, is that we have to have some breakthroughs in that area as well as, as microfabrication and facilities like that? Will some of that come into play, as you think, with this? 11:01 I, I definitely think it will, and we've had, uh, we've certainly had discussions with some of the chipset manufacturers and, and they will, uh, eventually this will have to reach that level. 11:09 Um, and the faster it, it does it, the easier it will be to, to migrate and fix the, the things that need to be, um, transitioned before quantum computers arrive large enough to break that encryption. 11:20 Uh, so, you know, and that's a good, very interesting question because if you talk to the chipset manufacturers, they will tell you that this is a five to seven-year timeline for them to start to, you know, integrate quantum safety into their chips. 11:32 It, it's not gonna be something that's done overnight. Uh, and, you know, you start to quickly bump up against that seven to fifteen-year timeline when it takes five to seven years to, to develop a new chipset. 11:42 Now, that necessarily won't necessarily need to be done right away. Uh, it's definitely something we wanna see in the, in the future. 11:48 But, uh, when you look at, and I think one of your previous guests mentioned automobiles, you know, they have a, uh, a fairly significant development cycle. 11:55 It's six to eight years to develop a new auto- automobile model or, or a major feature set. 12:01 Um, and they have a lifespan of, you know, on average about eleven and a half years, anywhere from eleven to fifteen years probably. Uh, and they have a, a massive recall or reca-- a co- a high cost of repair or recall. 12:12 So, you know, those cars that are going on the road today, um, or being developed today will certainly liveYou know, likely beyond the Y2Q range that I mentioned earlier. So... 12:23 And those are high value targets for a terrorist organization. 12:26 Uh, the ability to, you know, uh, operate a car remotely instead of having to physically be in the car, and we've seen, you know, examples of that in terrorist attacks in the past. 12:35 Um, but automakers, you know, they equate security with safety. So, uh... 12:40 And they're, they're, they're in a very tight spot right now because they're just starting to realize that they have a hundred million lines of code on wheels, and soon to be probably two hundred million lines of code with autonomous driving and the safety features that are coming. 12:53 Um, and they're gonna take-- it's gonna take them, you know, six or ten years to fix this, and they have automobiles that are being developed today that will live on the road beyond, uh, quantum computing. 13:03 So that's, uh, an area where the work needs to start today. Um, it should have started three years ago. That was the best time to start. But, uh, certainly the second-best time would be today. 13:12 Um, but it's, it's gonna take them a lot of time to, to solve that problem. 13:16 And you're saying that the auto industry is really gonna struggle and be affected by this quantum threat, is what you're describing right now, and they're one of those. 13:23 Are you saying other industries like them that are-- have to use a lot of code are really gonna struggle with as quantum keeps moving forward? Uh, yeah. 13:32 I think the key things that you need to think about when w-we look at, you know, where we would target our solutions first would be, you know, products that have a, a fairly long-term confidant- confidentiality, um, you know, requirement, uh, high-value assets with a long life. 13:48 I talked about the long development cycle. And then certainly the, the high cost to repair or recall. You know, we talked... I think one of your previous guests has mentioned critical infrastructure. 13:57 You know, things that we don't wanna think about, we put out into the field, and we wanna leave there for twenty years or forty years or, or whatever. 14:04 Um, certainly anything that passes that seven to fifteen-year range is of concern. Um, so there, there are plenty of things today. Y-will your cell phone need to be fixed? 14:14 No, 'cause it's a thousand-dollar piece of equipment that can be replaced very easily, and it's also, a, a model can be developed fairly quickly. 14:22 But when we talk about military equipment, we talk about, uh, automobiles, critical infrastructure and things that meet those, those criteria I mentioned, um, that's gonna take them a lot longer to fix and repair. 14:32 So the need to start now is absolutely critical. So when we look at this right now, we're talking now about trying to develop this large-scale quantum computer. You know, are we gonna see one anytime soon? 14:46 I mean, 'cause the way you're describing the automobile industry is years off that you're describing. You're, you're, you're saying these things that have lots of code are gonna struggle. 14:56 So are we going to see the perfect or, I don't even wanna say perfect, but an operational quantum computer that we're gonna be able anytime soon? 15:09 Well, it's a great question, and it's, it's one that gets asked, uh, quite a bit these days in the industry. 15:14 And we're-- our office is about, uh, half a kilometer away from the Institute for Quantum Computing here in Canada, which I think for a long time had the largest quantum computer until Intel surpassed them or my... 15:25 Or, uh, I should say IBM surpassed them. Um, so we are very close to those researchers and developers, and we have several of them on our staff here as well. 15:32 And so there's a raging debate about what, you know, first off, what size of quantum computer is going to be required to be able to, to, uh, do these positive disruption things on the commercial side and also be capable of breaking the PKI. 15:45 And there's various opinions. There's academic opinions. You know, I've heard one fairly, uh, high-level academic say that there's a one in six chance by twenty twenty-six that we will see that happen. 15:54 Um, NIST has come out and said, you know, twenty thirty you should be ready to have, uh, to be transitioned to a quantum safe solutions. Uh, NSA has also made some, some comments. So there's, there's a, a range. 16:06 Like as we said, we kind of call it the seven to fifteen year Y2Q range that we will see a quantum computer large enough. The question then, the second question becomes how large does it have to be? 16:16 And I, I believe your previous guest also talked a little bit about that. I've heard estimates from a thousand, uh, stable qubits to up to ten thousand stable qubits. 16:25 And that is certainly, uh, you know, a guesswork at this time. We don't know, uh, once we pass quantum supremacy, which, uh, Google and IBM and, and others have, uh, staked claims to being able to do that very soon. 16:37 In fact, I think Google had mentioned they would have it by the end of twenty seventeen. That didn't happen, but they did announce some simulation capability, um, that would prove quantum supremacy. 16:45 And for those who don't know, quantum supremacy is where we surpass supercomputer power. 16:50 And when we enter into that realm of, of computing power, we're now into a new realm which very well could drive the development of quantum computing much faster and accelerate that much faster. 17:00 The, the fifty-qubit computer could drive the hundred, the hundred could drive the thousand. So there's a lot of unknowns. There are certainly significant hurdles that still exist to, to build a quantum computer out. 17:10 But I think it's telling when, uh, the amount of investment that's being made by nation-states, also by industry players, um, and the fact that, you know, IBM has moved this from their research labs into their engineering labs, they have a path forward. 17:23 There's still significant hurdles, but they're moving now very rapidly and much more rapidly than they've ever moved before. It's really not a matter of if, it's, it's now a matter of when. 17:34 You made the statement just in, in all of that that you said a quantum safe security. What-- industry. What does that really mean? I mean, you know, what does that look like today? 17:44 And, and you've indicated some of the players, you know, Google, Intel, we talked about Microsoft and those. But I mean, what, what is-- are there gonna be others in that mix? 17:53 I know I've mentioned D-Wave, but who else is going to be playing into that? And, and really what does that quantum safe security industry really mean for anyone listening right now? 18:05 Well, I think the companies that you mentioned, and certainly some of the nations I've mentioned, uh, and the great investment that's being made, uh, is certainly, um, focused on developing quantum computers. 18:15 I think it's, it's-- there is a difference. Quantum security is a different market that's, you know, securing us from the threat of a quantum computer. 18:23 Within that market, there, there are quite a few players already there that are established. We have some competition already. 18:28 Uh, and I expect that this is something, a topic that you do not hear about when you-- I go to, you know, numerous cybersecurity showsBoth in, in vertical shows like in automotive industry, but also general cybersecurity and government cybersecurity shows. 18:41 In quantum computing, I'm usually the only person in the room who's talking about it. That's changing. It's starting to change pretty rapidly now. We're starting to see this become more mainstream issue. 18:50 The mere fact that I'm on your show talking about it indicates that it's, it's of interest to, to certain people now, and it's gonna grow very rapidly. 18:58 Um, and that awareness needs to be, you know, spread very quickly now because we're, we're at a point now where in, you know, some of these, uh, industries we talked about, they really needed to start this several years ago. 19:09 So the need to start it now is, is absolutely critical. And when I, when I say start now, and what, what they can do is, you know, first and foremost, understand where we use cryptography. 19:17 You know, a day in the life of, of cryptography for us is, is everywhere from your home security system, your thermostats, all of the, you know, interconnected devices we use in our home to our vehicle when we're on our way to work, the connected, connected car that, uh, we all are fully aware of how connected cars are now. 19:34 Whether you're on, uh, you know, a transportation system, a transit system, or, or you're on an airplane with air traffic control, all of these areas are using encryption, uh, you know, constantly, and it's very seamless and, and, you know, unknown to most end users. 19:48 You don't realize when, when you're even using encryption, but you're using it hundreds of times a day, and if not more, um, you know, whether you're at your computer at your office or your enterprise or your VPN, you know, connecting to your network and, and on and on and on. 20:01 So the, the way this needs to be solved is, is by me- a very seamless solution. So ideally, end users will have no, no reason to worry about this. 20:11 And if we do our jobs correctly, and when I say we, I mean OEMs and government and the companies supporting them, there will be no impact to the end user experience. 20:19 Uh, you'll, you'll, you'll just, you know, do your encryption transaction that you normally do, and it will work using a quantum safe encryption. 20:27 That's the goal and, and certainly the, the end game that we'd like to see happen. 20:32 And when we look at that, if there's no disruption, there's no interruption in any of this, um, do we think we'll stay ahead of the fears that are out there, you know, of, of what might disastrously happen, you know, the fear that might be out there? 20:51 I think, I think there's time. I definitely think there's time. I don't think this is a matter of fear, you know, creating fear and, and creating panic for anybody. 20:59 Um, I am concerned though that people are, are not, sometimes not taking it as serious as they should. I think a lot of people see, you know, and I'll use the automotive industry, for example. 21:07 I've spoken to many companies in that industry and cybersecurity experts. You know, they, they are very new to cybersecurity. 21:14 Like, they're just realizing, as I mentioned earlier, that they are essentially software companies that have software running on wheels now. 21:20 Um, they're just understanding the cybersecurity world, and they have, you know, many, many critical patches that they have to, uh, cover and, and holes that they have to patch. 21:30 Uh, and so for them, you know, they're very much, I would say, at the starting gate of, of cybersecurity and, and understanding how it affects automobiles. 21:38 Um, when I come along and say, "Hey, in nine years, you may face a quantum computer that can break all the encryption that you're using," you know, you really... That is... 21:46 That's, that's hard for them to understand, and it's also easy for them to say, "Well, I'll wait nine years to fix that." 21:52 And I think what we need to understand about quantum, uh, cryptography and the fact that quantum computers will break quantum, the cryptography we use today, is that's the bottom of the pyramid, if you will. 22:03 If you could imagine a pyramid of, of, uh, security within any organization or any product, um, you have different lel-levels and layers, you know, from a, from an enterprise security point of view. 22:13 You know, poor passwords or phishing, um, vulnerabilities, that's at the top of the pyramid and preparing people to make sure that that doesn't happen. 22:21 As you go further down, you get into the administration, the architecture, the platform, but the very bottom of that pyramid is cryptography. We sort of rely on cryptography for everything. 22:30 If you pull that layer the, of the pyramid out, um, all of the security that you have in place sort of collapses and falls apart. 22:37 And so, you know, in an automobile, the roots of trust, that is, you know, embedded physically in the, in the automobile, in an HSM somewhere in that automobile, and that's what allows you to, to authenticate software over-the-air updates, which Tesla is now moving very rapidly towards, and other auto manufacturers will soon follow. 22:54 I think the estimate is a thirty-five billion dollars in savings for using over-the-air software updates by as early as twenty twenty-two. So, you know, all of those software updates have to be authenticated. 23:05 If they're building those cars today with roots of trust that do not have quantum safety built into them, um, you know, they're putting those cars on the road, and then potentially in seven to fifteen years, that car still living on the road, uh, has, is now a threat. 23:19 It's, it's the quantum, the up-the updates that we're sending to that car, we can't be sure that they're authenticated and, and that they are the legitimate updates. 23:26 So that's a, a, a great example of, you know, the complexity of the problem and how it's very rooted at the very bottom of the pyramid or a physical part of a car. 23:36 Uh, and so that is, uh, you know, I think that illustrates to you, just from the automotive industry, how complex of an issue it is and why it's absolutely critical that the work to start, uh, fixing this happens immediately. 23:48 And I think, you know, Paul, what you've just explained is that's why the vulnerability can't be done with a quick patch. So I wanna thank you for joining us. 23:57 Paul Lussier, you are the vice president of business development at Isara. We really appreciate all the time you've spent with us today. Thank you so much. Well, it's great to be on your show, and I appreciate it. 24:07 I hope to speak to you again soon. Yeah. And your URL is www.isara, I-S-A-R-A,.com. Is that correct? That's correct. That is correct. All right. Well, thank you. All right, listeners. 24:18 There you can go to learn more about what they're doing. Thanks again. All right. 24:21 Well, we are out of time, but you can go up and, as we've said, check out any of the articles we've been talking about quantum comput-computing, or you can check out any of the, uh, at connectedworld.com, or you can go to thepeggySmedleyShow.com to listen to any of these great segments. 24:37 We've had some great guests who are talking about. We are going to take a short break, and in the meantime, we're gonna be back with a whole another hour. 24:45 We're gonna be talking about distracted driving and all this autonomous stuff, and we're actually gonna talk about how you can keep your eyes on the road and hands on the wheel. 24:52 Remember, this is The Peggy Smedley Show, the podcasting voice of IoT and relevant technology. We'll be right back.With great technology comes great responsibility. 25:04 Follow Internet of Things tech expert and futurist Peggy Smedley, repeatedly ranked as a top IoT and M2M influencer. 25:12 Go to Peggy_Smedley on Twitter for her take on the latest tech news and lively interviews with other industry insiders on her weekly radio show. Visit twitter.com and search for Peggy_Smedley to follow her today. 25:27 [upbeat music] Video consumption is on the rise. So to reach this audience, Constructek Magazine created Constructek TV. 25:38 Constructek TV helps construction professionals leverage emerging solutions to better their business. Tune in to constructek.tv to catch the latest show on the first and third Tuesday of each month. 25:49 Like, view, and subscribe to constructek.tv. Bringing dynamic video to construction. [upbeat music] Signal to noise, an electronic term with new relevance on the internet. 26:04 Connected World Media cuts through the noise of data overload and finds you the signal of important information, information that will keep you current and aware of context in the Internet of Things. 26:15 Peggy Smedley shares her insights on The Peggy Smedley Show and in Connected World Magazine, all online at connectedworld.com. Stay current and competitive at connectedworld.com [upbeat music] 26:29 Are you a small business or nonprofit? Securing Our eCity Foundation offers free cybersecurity seminars so businesses of every size can become more cyber safe. 26:39 According to Forbes, just one cybercrime incident can cost a company over fifteen million dollars. Protect yourself, your employees, and your business before you fall victim to the nation's fastest-growing crime. 26:50 Go right now to securingourecity.org or call six one nine-six three zero-two four four four. [upbeat music] Looking to be a successful entrepreneur? 27:02 The virtual assistant industry continues to be a top choice for those looking to start their own business. The problem can be how to become a virtual assistant. 27:10 Many turn to the bible of the VA industry, the book Virtual Assistant: The Series, and it's the perfect guide for office managers, executive assistants, and other administrative professionals looking to make the transition from employee to successful business owner. 27:25 Go to vatheseries.com to get your copy today. Education. Industry experts. Back to the basics. Is your company using the Internet of Things to its fullest potential? 27:35 Enlist the Peggy Smedley Institute and its team of experts to create a customized plan for how to apply the IoT to your specific needs. 27:44 Learn everything you need to know to achieve tangible business outcomes in today's digital economy. Contact us at six three zero-nine three three-zero eight four four. 27:53 That's six three zero-nine three three-zero eight four four, or visit learnatIoT.com.
